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Help needed with Tooway installation

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Sep 25th, 2008 at 11:54am  
Hi,

I'm a newbie here.

I've recently purchased a Tooway system from Tariam (under the guise of Tariam homenet) and am trying to get it to work. The local sky satellite guy has stuck the dish on the wall but is having trouble getting it aligned. Good southerly aspect but he can't find the hotbird signal with his meter.

I've talked to Tariam but they're not very helpful and just want to charge me loads of money for an engineer. They say it can be done with the cheapo meter they've lent me.

I've read the topics here and think I understand the problems but, having no head for heights, am loathe to try to fix myself. I know that several people here who have done successful installations are based in Wales (I'm near Machynlleth)

Can anybody recommend someone who could come out and get it working?

best wishes

richard garrett
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Reply #1 - Sep 25th, 2008 at 3:17pm  
The TRIA uses unusual high voltages on Rx and Tx cables and ideally requires a special tunable meter and specific instructions.

Suggest to your local satellite installer that they connect their meter (at their own risk) to the TRIA receive connector with a short cable and do not connect their meter to the modem.
Connect the transmit cable from the modem TX to the TRIA TX input and power ON at the modem. Note that the modem RX input is left disconnected at this time.

Only a small increase in power may be detected when the dish is pointed at the satellite. Even so, peak up very accurately and the result will be fine.

Do not try to do the alignment yourself.  Get expert help and warn them about high voltages. Even 24 volts can give you a shock and make you fall off a ladder.

Best regards, Eric.
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Reply #2 - Sep 26th, 2008 at 3:31pm  
Dear Sir

We have a special meter you can borrow for Tooway if the sky agent is having problems , I am sure Tariam have these and should be able to sort this out , please get back to me if you are having issues

A.E.Walker
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Reply #3 - Sep 26th, 2008 at 6:43pm  
Hello,

I'm an installer with a number of Tooway installs completed now and I've found without fail that the low cost meters suppliers send out do not work correctly to get the dish aligned optimally. Almost every installation I've been to that has been self installed or by an installer who does not know what they are doing is sometimes on the signal but not accurately enough to get the best speeds or even keep the signal all the time.
I'm happy for you or anyone else to contact me by email or phone for advice if you are stuck.

Paul Harrison
+44 1252 560018
+34 687 256 240
Skype handle SatManES
Email: Paul.Harrison@notesconsultants.co.uk
Web site: http://www.NotesConsultants.bttradespace.com
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Reply #4 - Sep 30th, 2008 at 12:46pm  
Thank you for all  your helpful replies. I will keep you informed as things progress.

best

richard
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Reply #5 - Sep 30th, 2008 at 8:34pm  
Hi,

I just installed a Tariam system and they sent me the co-ordinates for my area, ask for cedric. I used their co-ordinates but found I was about 7 degrees out. I used their cheepo meter, which they charged me 300 with a 200 refund on return. what a nerve, I thought I was going to get a sophisticated spectrum analyzier for that price, not one that I bought for 15 at my local DIY store.... Anyway I got it set up straight away, but I had to track the dish further south than I was told. I ste the sat-finder on very low decibels and then I picked up the signal and it was easy to track it in. I am getting 8db on noise to db's, which I was told was good. I have to tell you there is no way you will get the 384kbps upload speed that they advertise!! I an getting an averagre of 60-65kbps. A case of misrepresentation methinks. Also you will not get a free SMTP e-mail that is advertised with the system, you will have to go to another provider for that, they have told me they will refund the 24 per year that that is costing.
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Reply #6 - Oct 1st, 2008 at 4:28pm  
Tooway might be quoting that but I bought the system on the strength of the 384kbps that Tariam advertise, also Tariam advertise that you get "Free Tariam SMTP e-mail service". Not a happy bunny as I went for their system because it was the only one that gave the SMTP option. I would have gone for the cheaper system that gave the same service without the SMTP had I known, also I went for their system because of the quoted upload speed as I wanted to use Skype.
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Reply #7 - Oct 1st, 2008 at 6:49pm  
[quote author=boussagues link=1222340041/0#9 date=1222874922]Tooway might be quoting that but I bought the system on the strength of the 384kbps that Tariam advertise, also Tariam advertise that you get "Free Tariam SMTP e-mail service". Not a happy bunny as I went for their system because it was the only one that gave the SMTP option. I would have gone for the cheaper system that gave the same service without the SMTP had I known, also I went for their system because of the quoted upload speed as I wanted to use Skype.[/quote]

I am not a Tariam fan but (competition :) :

* Download speeds "up to" 2048 kbps, upload up to 384 kbps

It says UP TO and not 384 :(

384 is max speed at a KA system (east europe)
156 is max speed at a KU systems (most of west europe)
Dont forget, its a "shared bandwidth" service.

* Email and browsing
I agree they should provide smtp if promised.
Get you $$ back and go for a smtp account at Gradwell, cheaper to !
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« Last Edit: Mar 13th, 2012 at 3:16pm by Admin1 »  
 
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Reply #8 - Oct 2nd, 2008 at 12:01am  
The 256k uplink requirement presumably refers to a 256k uplink shared by perhaps just 10 sites.  This is a lot less than 50 or so sites which might reasonably be expected to share a 256k uplink.

I would express the need as being for between 10.8 kbit/s and 32 kbit/s (depending on header compression) and up to 100kbit/s depending on codec, with a requirement that the capacity be provided as a steady stream of packets at about 0.25 to 1 second intervals.  It is no good trying to transmit speech in long 1 second high speed blocks, but only every 10 seconds or more.

Best regards, Eric.
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Reply #9 - Oct 3rd, 2008 at 6:29pm  
Quote:
I had already self-install clients installing without a meter at all (must be luck), the best will be a Spectrum anylizer (we always use) but I have also a good experiance with any cheap meter, just need some patience and take your time.


I guess I must be one of those self-install clients Frits of Molino systems mentions since I did indeed manage to install the system without a meter (and I'm sure a great deal of luck)

As I think has been mentioned in previous posts if you have an infinite amount of patience and are familiar with satellite dish alignment basics it can be done. Just make sure you have a clear view from the install location, your pole mount is 100% vertical and set the elevation and skew as accurately as possible. Align the dish as closely to the azimuth as possible and swing the antena a degree at a time until you see the modem receive led start to double flash.

Remember the modem does not respond immediately so each time you move the dish you must give it 30 seconds or so to respond.

Worth mentioning that in my case even though I set the elevation scale correctly according to my location I eventually had to add another degree to get a good lock. Mount pole not completely plumb or scale not 100% accurate, not sure but regardless it's worth bearing in mind should you continue to have problems.

All in it took me a couple of days and even then I still had to carry out some final adjustments to get it spot on. As Molino systems had said to me many times if it is not 101% aligned it will either simply not work or you will get erratic results with the lock being lost etc.

Summing up, if you have a spectrum analizer then great but since most of us non profesional types don't tend to have one lying about the garage floor then don't be put off. Some kind of a meter like a horizon minisat would be a help but if not then it can be done with the modem only. Albeit a huge pain in the *

Kind regards, Scott
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Reply #10 - Oct 3rd, 2008 at 9:10pm  
Actually there is no "UP TO" to be seen in any of the specs and there is no mention of shared bandwidth. In their specs it says that on the Ku band it is a maximum of 156Kbps. My system is running on Ka.

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« Last Edit: Feb 18th, 2015 at 12:18pm by Admin1 »  
 
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Reply #11 - Oct 8th, 2008 at 5:25pm  
Hi

Further to my earlier posts.

I got an engineer from Aberystwyth Electonics to come out yesterday (tuesday) with a spectrum analyser and point the dish in the right direction. He said the signal from Hotbird 6 seem to come in irregular pulses but according to another thread here, tuesday was one of the days when tooway was having problems.

Now, the modem RX indicator still gives a regular single flash but occasionally goes into two flashes followed by one flash  on the TX indicator.

What is ranging anyway?

Any suggestions as to a next step?

Tariam are not helping much, I asked them about a specialist meter and they said the cheap one should work. I even emailed their operations people about getting an engineer out and they have yet to reply. I'm not terribly happy.

best

richard
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Reply #12 - Oct 8th, 2008 at 6:12pm  
Hi richardq,

There have been times this week when TooWay has been "peculiar" but the normal Hotbird 6 satellite usage may have been ok, in particular, very heavy rain may have stopped Ka band but not the others.

Can you have a look at the scale settings on your rig - the elevation and polarisation, and post them here? You are not too far away from me in SW. Wales so they should be similar and I can tell you whether the setting are in the right order.

Regards,

Tony
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Reply #13 - Oct 9th, 2008 at 10:05am  
Just to add my 5 cents here on Tariam self install kits, I am going to be blunt and say that they are a big rip off.

Days of fannying around without the correct tools. As it turned out the cable wasn't in the connector properly, but without the correct crimping tool I really could not have secure it in any further. Being reasonably handy with stuff like this it hurt my pride not being able to install it and finally had to get in a pro.

The self install kit cost 200 Euros. Included some cable a cheapo sub 10 quid meter and the "detailed instructions" consisted of the dish assembly manual and the modem manual! The whole operation can be done by a professional  for less than 200 euros.

Even on the Tooway website it recommends the use of a professional installer, and as mentioned by an installer here to get it finely tuned its obvious you are going to need either the correct tools or a LOT of time.

So just because it can be installed by DIY it doesn't mean it should be - especially when it costs the poor unsuspecting customer more for the considerable inconvenience.  I will never get those wasted days back!

My advice to anyone looking at investing in a satellite Internet system, check the self install kit costs carefully, call your local satellite engineer and compare the costs. If  he isn't already cheaper - ask yourself how much is your own time worth ?

Regards,

Alex
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Reply #14 - Oct 9th, 2008 at 7:04pm  
Quote:
Just to add my 5 cents here on Tariam self install kits, I am going to be blunt and say that they are a big rip off.

Days of fannying around without the correct tools. As it turned out the cable wasn't in the connector properly, but without the correct crimping tool I really could not have secure it in any further. Being reasonably handy with stuff like this it hurt my pride not being able to install it and finally had to get in a pro.

The self install kit cost 200 Euros. Included some cable a cheapo sub 10 quid meter and the "detailed instructions" consisted of the dish assembly manual and the modem manual! The whole operation can be done by a professional for less than 200 euros.

Even on the Tooway website it recommends the use of a professional installer, and as mentioned by an installer here to get it finely tuned its obvious you are going to need either the correct tools or a LOT of time.

So just because it can be installed by DIY it doesn't mean it should be - especially when it costs the poor unsuspecting customer more for the considerable inconvenience. I will never get those wasted days back!

My advice to anyone looking at investing in a satellite Internet system, check the self install kit costs carefully, call your local satellite engineer and compare the costs. If he isn't already cheaper - ask yourself how much is your own time worth ?

Regards,

Alex


Next time, please call us and/or visit our web site. We are NOT cheaper but ................ we deliver 200% quality !

If you want to install yourself, no problem, the whole kit is tested, activated and including professional 2x25m RG6 cable + connectors already fitted. Just fit the dish, point it, connect the coax cable to the modem, the network cable to your PC or router if you want to use more than 1 PC and ...... GOOGLE. The only tricky part is the pointing, you realy have to make sure it's well done !

...
A good set of cables + connectors fitted ! (2x25m RG6).
RED=TX and BLUE=RX

Total self-install kit (modem already activated and tested) : euro 786,00

SPECIAL SATSIG PRICE : euro 750,00 (till 1-1-2009)

Prices without shipping and tax.
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« Last Edit: Feb 18th, 2015 at 12:21pm by Admin1 »  
 
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Reply #15 - Oct 28th, 2008 at 11:21am  
Dear all,

sorry not to reply sooner. family and other commitments have kept me pretty busy of late.

I think I need someone who knows what they're doing to come and rescue this set up.  I've e-mailed operations at tariam without reply.

Can anyone quote me for this? or, Is there anyone who has successfully self-installed who would come and have a go for a consideration? (Location: Mid Wales Coast)

Please contact me off-list.

getting bored now.

best

richard
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Reply #16 - Oct 28th, 2008 at 1:00pm  
Quote:
Dear all,

sorry not to reply sooner. family and other commitments have kept me pretty busy of late.

I think I need someone who knows what they're doing to come and rescue this set up. I've e-mailed operations at tariam without reply.

Can anyone quote me for this? or, Is there anyone who has successfully self-installed who would come and have a go for a consideration? (Location: Mid Wales Coast)

Please contact me off-list.

getting bored now.

best

richard


Contact us, we can help you !

I am sure we can not make everybody 100% happy, but at least we try !

Life can be so easy Smiley
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« Last Edit: Feb 18th, 2015 at 12:15pm by Admin1 »  
 
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Reply #17 - Nov 4th, 2008 at 7:06pm  
Please read Tariam status
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