Logo

Satellite Internet Forum.
Please note that this forum is now READ ONLY and closed for login and changes
The new forum is here Space and Satellite Communications forum

Welcome, Guest.
Welcome to this satellite broadband discussion forum.  Wherever you are and whatever your problem we are here to help each other. Connecting to the internet via satellite is not always easy but is critically important to those in remote places or with poor terrestrial infrastructure.  Both service providers and customers are encouraged to contribute.  Read the Forum rules.
      Satellite internet forum          

Re: Tooway problems

(Read 24757 times)
bermudy25
Ex Member


Aug 12th, 2009 at 5:13pm  
Hi there, I live in a rural area of Spain where there is no conventional cable-provided internet service, hence the reason for signing up with a satellite service. I've been  subscribed two months now to the Tooway satellite service through a licensed provider in Valencia, Spain that goes under the name Sistelbanda, S.A.
My problem with the system is that after a couple of days of adequate, but not impresive speed, it slips into super slow mode that takes forever to open pages and oftentimes the fatidic notice "Internet Explorer cannot open the page" pops up.  Sistelbanda's explanation is that I exceed my quota of megabites and when that happens the service slows down (radically) or cops out altogether until the overload clears up.  Now, I would understand that if I were downloading stuff like movies, videos , photos, etc., but I use internet just to access my e-mail, read daily a North american newspaper I'm subscribed to, and occasionally to surf the net for some product to compare prices, etc.  When I signed up with Sistelbanda they said that  such activities as I've described consume few kilobites because it involves only written text and that even the basic package would be enough for my needs.
I'm writing to you because  I saw your  comment "any Tooway wo has problem with the system call us", and I would like to hear your opinion as to what is happening to me .
Thanks in advance,
L.J. Gomez     bermudy25@graffiti.net
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
pladecalvo
Ex Member


Reply #1 - May 13th, 2012 at 9:28pm  
Quote:
I've been  subscribed two months now to the Tooway satellite service through a licensed provider in Valencia, Spain that goes under the name Sistelbanda, S.A.
My problem with the system is that after a couple of days of adequate, but not impresive speed, it slips into super slow mode that takes forever to open pages and oftentimes the fatidic notice "Internet Explorer cannot open the page" pops up.
It's nothing you're doing friend, it's Tooway. They should be called 'TooSlow'

I've had it installed for 6 month and it's been rubbish since day one. My contract is up in November and I can't wait to throw it in the bin!
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Gary-BW
Ex Member


Reply #2 - May 26th, 2012 at 9:02am  
Good Morning,
We (Bentley Walker) have over 2000 happy Tooway KA users, whilst there is an active FAP mechanism on the platform so long as you pick the right package you should be ok. Which package are you currently using?
Are you able to provide more detailed information concerning what you use the connection for? Also; are you the only person using the connection? The good thing about the Tooway KA system is that you can purchase volume boosters if you exceed your 4 weekly quota, allowing you to operate at full speed again. We also provide our users with access to a usage portal so that they can keep track of their data consumption.
You are more than welcome to contact us for assistance with your Tooway KA:

Bentley Walker Tooway KA Site:
http://www.bentley-walker.com/tooway/

Sales:
+44 (0) 2392 311 106
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
pladecalvo
Ex Member


Reply #3 - May 27th, 2012 at 4:31pm  
I am using Tooway 6.
I only use the connection for e-mail and web browsing.
I do not down-load films or music.
I have never, ever exceeded 50% of my 4-weekly quota.
I am the only person using the connection.

According to Tooway, my system is working as it should be. So, if that is true, I must conclude that 30 second or more to load a random web-page is normal for a satellite connection and if it is true that 30 seconds or more to load a page is normal for a satellite connection...then Tooway should not be advertising 'FAST' broadband, because 'FAST' is one thing that it isn't.

I have been asking three people at Tooway the same two questions for over six months now and they refuse to answer them.

1. Is 30 seconds or more page load time is an acceptable time for a alleged speed of 6kbps?

2. If it is, why are you advertising THAT as FAST?

They won't answer.

I have done various test proposed by Tooway and some of the members here and it would appear that my download speed is around 6kbps.

So perhaps it's me and I have wrongly assumed that a satellite connection is fast when in fact, it isn't.
Back to top
« Last Edit: May 28th, 2012 at 5:28pm by Admin1 »  
 
IP Logged
 
Admin1
YaBB Administrator
*****
Offline


Personal text from: Profile,
Options, Top line

Posts: 844
Reply #4 - May 27th, 2012 at 5:35pm  
Please tell us the url of a page that takes 30 seconds to load and we can all try that same page and see what we get.

How long does it take to display http://www.satsig.net/ home page now that I have added four "social network" buttons that I suspect slows it down a lot ?

What result do you get for my speed test page http://www.satsig.net/speed-test/speed-tester.htm ?

What DNS servers are you using ?

Best regards, Eric.
Back to top
 
WWW  
IP Logged
 
europe-satellite.com
Ex Member


Reply #5 - May 27th, 2012 at 5:36pm  
Quote:
I am using Tooway 6.
I only use the connection for e-mail and web browsing.
I do not down-load films or music.
I have never, ever exceeded 50% of my 4-weekly quota.
I am the only person using the connection.

According to Tooway, my system is working as it should be. So, if that is true, I must conclude that 30 second or more to load a random web-page is normal for a satellite connection and if it is true that 30 seconds or more to load a page is normal for a satellite connection...then Tooway should not be advertising 'FAST' broadband, because 'FAST' is one thing that it isn't.

I have been asking three people at Tooway the same two questions for over six months now and they refuse to answer them.

1. Is 30 seconds or more page load time is an acceptable time for a alleged speed of 6kbps?

2. If it is, why are you advertising THAT as FAST?

They won't answer.

I have done various test proposed by Tooway and some of the members here and it would appear that my download speed is around 6kbps.

So perhaps it's me and I have wrongly assumed that a satellite connection is fast when in fact, it isn't.

Dear Mr. Cummings,

You wrote us on 19-05-2012 the following:

"I appreciate you trying to help Frits but with someone as dumb as I am regarding technical stuff, I think you are going to be banging your head against the wall."

"Yep! I just wouldn't have a clue how to 'reset IP address'. You might as well as me to give a talk on nuclear fusion. Ha-Ha!!"

It will be close to impossible for any help-desk to support you from remote !

Don't you think it is time to get a good IT engineer locally, to check your system (I mean not the Satellite system but all connected equipment, routers, computers etc.) instead of complaining over 6 months.

You need to have an IT expert to check over your computer equipment and routers etc. (incl. settings) - this could solve all your problems.

Frits Blomsma
El Molino Systems S.L.
Back to top
« Last Edit: May 27th, 2012 at 9:19pm by N/A »  
 
IP Logged
 
pladecalvo
Ex Member


Reply #6 - May 27th, 2012 at 7:29pm  
Quote:
Please tell us the url of a page that takes 30 seconds to load and we can all try that same page and see what we get.

How long does it take to display http://www.satsig.net/ home page now that I have added four "social network" buttons that I suspect slows it down a lot ?

What result do you get for my speed test page http://www.satsig.net/speed-test/speed-tester.htm ?

What DNS servers are you using ?

Best regards, Eric.


Results from your tester.

1st 30kBytes took 5 mS. So download speed is approx = 6000 kBytes/sec = 48000 kbits/sec

2nd 30kBytes took 10 mS. So download speed is approx = 3000 kBytes/sec = 24000 kbits/sec

3rd 30kBytes took 11 mS. So download speed is approx = 2727 kBytes/sec = 21818 kbits/sec

4th 30kBytes took 2 mS. So download speed is approx = 15000 kBytes/sec = 120000 kbits/sec

Overall average download speed is approx = 4286 kBytes/sec = 34288 kbits/sec
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
pladecalvo
Ex Member


Reply #7 - May 27th, 2012 at 7:41pm  
Quote:
Dear Mr. Cummings,

You wrote us on 19-05-2012 the following:

"I appreciate you trying to help Frits but with someone as dumb as I am regarding technical stuff, I think you are going to be banging your head against the wall."

Don't you think it is time to get a good IT engineer locally, to check your system (I mean not the Satellite system but all connected equipment, routers, computers etc.) instead of complaining over 6 months.

You need to have an IT expert to check over your computer equipment and routers etc. (incl. settings) - this could solve all your problems.

Frits Blomsma
El Molino Systems S.L.
Fits,

As I have told you on numerous occasions...I HAVE had everything checked. The dish alignment has been checked. The router has been checked. I have connected four other computers to the system, including a brand new one that the technician brought with him. I have had my computer disk formatted and a new Windows installed to eliminate computer problems.

The reason I don't think the problem is my end is, as I have also explained to you numerous times, is that at 3 or 4am there is no problem with it, pages load in 5-10 seconds. Come 8am and it gets slower. This continues through the day. The later it gets,  the slower it gets. Now please explain to me how, if the problem is my end, it is very fast at night but slows to a deathly crawl during the day.

That, even to someone with my limited technical knowledge, would suggest that the problem is connected to the amount of people using the system...wouldn't you say??

As for "complaining for six months"....people ask and I answer.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
pladecalvo
Ex Member


Reply #8 - May 27th, 2012 at 7:53pm  
Quote:
Please tell us the url of a page that takes 30 seconds to load and we can all try that same page and see what we get.



Just a few random pages tried at 20:45 today.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/iceland
Took 35.54secs

http://www.lonelyplanet.com/south-korea
= 27.23secs

http://www.channel4.com/news/assad-circle-could-be-charged-with-crimes-against-h...
= 19.07secs

http://www.skysports.com/football/match_report/0,19764,11065_3485652,00.html
= 26.85secs


I will try those again tomorrow as Monday is usually a day when it's so slow that I give up.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Admin1
YaBB Administrator
*****
Offline


Personal text from: Profile,
Options, Top line

Posts: 844
Reply #9 - May 28th, 2012 at 9:51am  
10, 9, 7, 13 seconds on 10 Mbit/s cable modem.
cache cleared, then repeated..
7, 9, 12, 7 seconds on 10 Mbit/s cable modem.

My speed test http://www.satsig.net/speed-test/speed-tester.htm?1338195191375
repeated several times gives between 7.6 and 11 Mbit/s

The very high speeds you noted with my speed tester may be due to the entire page being held in your modem for a second and then passed to your PC on a 100 Mbit/s ethernet cable link. An alternative explanation might be that the Tooway system is compressing the html text of page for transmission over the satellite.

Best regards, Eric.
Back to top
 
WWW  
IP Logged
 
pladecalvo
Ex Member


Reply #10 - May 28th, 2012 at 11:52am  
Back to top
« Last Edit: May 28th, 2012 at 5:30pm by Admin1 »  
 
IP Logged
 
europe-satellite.com
Ex Member


Reply #11 - May 28th, 2012 at 1:24pm  
Sorry but you waste your time, contact your provider !

You, your provider and Skylogic have to communicate and try to solve it.
Back to top
« Last Edit: May 28th, 2012 at 5:28pm by Admin1 »  
 
IP Logged
 
pladecalvo
Ex Member


Reply #12 - May 28th, 2012 at 2:52pm  
Quote:
Sorry but you waste your time, contact your provider !

You, your provider and Skylogic have to communicate and try to solve it.
...and what would be the point in that when every time I contact them i get the same fob off about there being nothing wrong, like........

"You must understand this is a satellite broadband service and there would be a difference from this service to a normal Dongle or Land line service. The service is running to optimal performance."

Franscois Grobler
Technical Support
------------------------------------------------------------
"After reviewing both the videos you sent us and the latest speed probe test, it has been noted that your system is running at nominal performance."

Stefan
------------------------------------------------------------
"After talking to Stefan and Franscois in Technical, I believe that every avenue has been investigated. This is simply the difference between satellite and ADSL broadband.

Technical are happy that your system is operating as it should do. I'm sorry I could not be of further help."

Trina
Technical Support
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
europe-satellite.com
Ex Member


Reply #13 - May 28th, 2012 at 3:52pm  
...
Tooway KA-SAT system installed in France.

Time to get an professional engineer to check your system and test it together with your provider.

But if you don't want to spend $$$,$$ on this you will never solve it.

Continually complaining on this board is not going to help you (sorry but somebody has to tell you this).

FREE OFFER --> Bring your system incl. all equipment to our office in Spain and we can test it for you.
Back to top
« Last Edit: May 29th, 2012 at 9:12pm by N/A »  
 
IP Logged
 
pladecalvo
Ex Member


Reply #14 - May 29th, 2012 at 8:26pm  
The equipment is working perfectly as long as you use it between 2am and 8am. The problem is obviously connected to usage not equipment failure.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
bigdishsat
Ex Member


Reply #15 - May 29th, 2012 at 8:44pm  
Here's a direct question to the unhappy pladecalvo ...
Has your service provider offered to release you from your 12 month commitment and give you a full refund ?

Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
pladecalvo
Ex Member


Reply #16 - May 30th, 2012 at 5:56am  
Quote:
Here's a direct question to the unhappy pladecalvo ...
Has your service provider offered to release you from your 12 month commitment and give you a full refund ?


No. I did tell them that I would not be renewing the contract in November and yet another person asked me why that was but they did not offer a release from the contract.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
toowayinternet
Ex Member


Reply #17 - Jun 4th, 2012 at 5:52pm  
With all respect, but i have found the Tooway service to be very reliable, we are a dutch reseller and do things with tooway you would not think possible.

But the latency is an issue if you don't have the technical knowledge and or hardware to work around the limitations.

with 2-3 tooway sets we are doing live webcast for broadcasters, provide internet for events and even supplied internet up to 25000 visitors with WiFi, 3 Tooway kits and specialized hardware to make this possible.

when installing the systems we always test every system and alway get between 9 and 10Mbps down an between 3-4 Mbps up with our tooway 10+ subscribtions.

the only limitation we are experiencing is the amount of simultaneous connections the viasat modems can handle.

(10000 mobile phones generates massive amounts of connections if you let them;))

When clients have speed problems they are mostly if not always related to the client hardware not tooway.

Kind regards,

Ricardo
toowayinternet.nl
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
pladecalvo
Ex Member


Reply #18 - Jun 5th, 2012 at 6:17am  
Quote:
When clients have speed problems they are mostly if not always related to the client hardware not tooway.

Kind regards,

Ricardo
toowayinternet.nl
The system has been checked. As I said in other posts...at 2 or 3am it's not a problem, it's from 8am to midnight that I get the problems. Wouldn't this suggest to you that the slow speed is connected to how many people are using the service? If there was anything wrong with the equipment it would be as slow during the night as it in the day, wouldn't it?
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
SuperDave
Ex Member


Reply #19 - Jun 5th, 2012 at 2:36pm  
After reading over all the posts about Tooway service I thought Id chime in with a couple of thoughts but first let me say that Im not a Tooway user or expert on their service plans or business models but I am knowledgeable on how ISPs function. Different ISPs GENERALLY pay about the same for Bandwidth for a coverage area, I wont go into all the variables but large ISPs are usually  able to procure bulk bandwidth (leasing full transponders for longer contracted periods resulting in lower procurement costs)  When a ISP is selling TDMA services to customers its all about Contention Ratios; i.e. the balance of how many customers to load into a set amount of bandwidth. Load it with too many heavy users and you run out of timeslots during heavy usage hours. At that point your customers become frustrated and seek service elsewhere (resulting in lost profits).  If a ISP keeps the contention low, the service is great but they must charge more to make a profit, keep in mind that how much profit they aim to make is usually a decision made by financial wizards and not by the network engineering wizards! Until poor service and network performance begins to drive customers away and affects the bottomline, those  financial guys wont take notice of customer satisfaction. Alternately if you bought the low end package they offer youve basically asked to be placed in a high contention network! Cheap and Fast service dont go together in the SATCOM world, you clearly get what you pay for so be leary of those providers who promise both!

Id recommend using a program like JPERF to test performance and various hours (JPERF is more accurate than those speedtest websites - which are great for terrestrial network tests but not ideal for VSAT testing). Run the tests at various times of the day, record your JPERF results, esclate your case to  supervisor levels at your ISP and ask the hard questions of them about their contention ratios on the network your assigned to.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
europe-satellite.com
Ex Member


Reply #20 - Jun 5th, 2012 at 2:55pm  
Quote:
When a ISP is selling TDMA services to customers its all about Contention Ratios; i.e. the balance of how many customers to load into a set amount of bandwidth.

Avanti-Hylas Ka band Contention Ratios (Hylas-1 Satellite):

Consumer packages 50:1
Professional packages 25:1

... How to test a modem click here.
Back to top
« Last Edit: Jun 6th, 2012 at 8:57am by N/A »  
 
IP Logged
 
toowayinternet
Ex Member


Reply #21 - Jun 5th, 2012 at 4:27pm  
@ pladecalvo

Wouldn't this suggest to you that the slow speed is connected to how many people are using the service?

It is possible, but unlikely as the service is hardly a year old and it would surprise me if your spotbeam is at peak capacity.

but i can think off multiple other scenarios what can cause your slowdowns, did you ever test a clean installed computer with direct network cable connection to your modem?




Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
bigdishsat
Ex Member


Reply #22 - Jun 5th, 2012 at 9:48pm  
Quote:
Avanti-Hylas Ka band Contention Ratios (Hylas-1 Satellite):

Consumer packages 50:1
Professional packages 25:1

Tooway does not publish this information.



Tooway Home Packages 50:1
Tooway Pro Packages 20:1

Smiley
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Eric Johnston
YaBB Moderator
*****
Offline


Personal text from Profile,
Options, Top line

Posts: 2107
Reply #23 - Jun 5th, 2012 at 10:21pm  
What "Up to" bit rates do each of those Avanti-Hylas 1:50 and 1:25 and Tooway 1:50 and 1:20 contention ratios apply ?

500 people sharing 10 Mbit/s, or 50 people sharing 1 Mbit/s, would not suprise me for a minimum consumer type service.

Best regards, Eric.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
pladecalvo
Ex Member


Reply #24 - Jun 6th, 2012 at 9:59am  
Quote:
It is possible, but unlikely as the service is hardly a year old and it would surprise me if your spotbeam is at peak capacity.

but i can think off multiple other scenarios what can cause your slowdowns, did you ever test a clean installed computer with direct network cable connection to your modem?




Yep! Tried a brand new lap-top and it was the same. Also had a disk format on my own computer and then a new Windows 7 installed.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
pladecalvo
Ex Member


Reply #25 - Jun 6th, 2012 at 10:04am  
Quote:
@ pladecalvo

.....did you ever test a clean installed computer with direct network cable connection to your modem?
Could you explain "direct network cable connection" please.

Sorry but I'm not a techie!!
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
europe-satellite.com
Ex Member


Reply #26 - Jun 6th, 2012 at 11:03am  
Quote:
Could you explain "direct network cable connection" please.

Sorry but I'm not a techie!!

... How to test a modem click here.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Eric Johnston
YaBB Moderator
*****
Offline


Personal text from Profile,
Options, Top line

Posts: 2107
Reply #27 - Jun 6th, 2012 at 12:00pm  
Eutelsat did publish information about their KA-SAT satellite: 70 Gbit/s.
Regarding the number of customers, this is now estimated as "over 1M customers" (not 2M as previously thought).

I guess something like this for clear sky propagation conditions:
82 customer downlink beams, each 6 x 69.5 Mbit/s carriers,  total = 34 Gbit/s
8 hub downlink beams, each 450 x 10 Mbit/s carriers, total = 36 Gbit/s

By my reckoning, with an ultimate 1.2M customers, evenly distributed across all beams, that makes each 10 Mbit/s of download capacity shared by 350 customers. i.e 1:350 contention ratio for the "up to 10 Mbit/s service"

I am very surprised at signs of congestion appearing so soon with KA-SAT (slow during the day and fast at night) but it is possible that not all of the ultimate 70 Gbit/s capacity claimed is yet implemented in the gateway hub earth station equipments.

Maybe there is only one 69.5 Mbit/s downlink carrier activated in that beam ? Shared with 2400+ customers ? How can we find out?

If anyone has a spectrum analyser on a downlink, how many carriers can you see and what is the carrier bandwidth?.  A  DVB-S2 type outlink, in clear sky with 69.5 Mbit/s info rate, operating 8-PSK with 5/6 FEC would have a -3.8 dB bandwidth of 27.8 MHz.  What can you see?.

When customers are allowed to download at speeds up to 10 Mbit/s it does not take much to cause congestion.  If 2400 customers share 69.5 Mbit/s it only takes 7 of them to be actively downloading at 10 Mbit/s each, to fully saturate the capacity. The Fair Access Policy (FAP) is supposed to assure fair shares by limiting "Up to speeds" and amounts of Mbytes downloaded per sliding time window period (1 hour, 4 weeks). The 1 second sliding time window is obviously 1.2 Mbytes (for "Up to 10 Mbit/s" service).  I wonder why they don't have 6 second, 1 minute, 6 minute and 60 minute sliding time windows to discourage prolonged 10 Mbit/s downloading ?  

If you want to compare Tooway with Avanti-Hylas we need to know what is the maximum bit rate associated with the Avanti-Hylas 1:50 ratio. I've see a 1:300 contention ratio quoted for Tooway but have no idea what "Up to" bit rate it was associated with.

All above is much guess work; can anyone clarify with better figures please?

I wrote something like this, several years ago:
"When calculating the downlink bit rate capacity required, allow 10 to 14 kbit/s per PC, so if you have 100 sites, each with 1 PC, you need at least a 1 Mbit/s download carrier."
I think, now in 2012, with increasing customer expectations about the downloading of "media" type content the downlink bit rate capacity required per PC should be increased, perhaps to 30 kbit/s per PC. 

Best regards, Eric.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
pladecalvo
Ex Member


Reply #28 - Jun 6th, 2012 at 2:29pm  
Quote:
Yes, I've tested it that way.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
europe-satellite.com
Ex Member


Reply #29 - Jun 6th, 2012 at 2:41pm  
Does anybody read the words "UP TO" Smiley

...

and the small prints ?

What is Tooway™?
Tooway™ is a bi-directional high speed satellite internet service for internet access. Bi-directional means that receive and transmit functions are performed via the satellite; therefore there is no need for a telephone line.

What speeds can I achieve?
There are various speeds available; offering download speeds of up to 10 Mbps and upload speeds of up to 4 Mbps.

What data quotas do you offer?
Anything from 4GB up to 100GB

Download and upload speed info is always the maximum info and not guaranteed.

Tooway (and most of the other systems) is a shared service and has different levels of limits (see some older messages on this board). If it was not this way users will end up to pay $ 99999,99 per month.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
bigdishsat
Ex Member


Reply #30 - Jun 6th, 2012 at 11:09pm  
Eric Johnston wrote on Jun 6th, 2012 at 12:00pm:


All above is much guess work; can anyone clarify with better figures please?


As a slight aside, this is from the SkyDSL website:

"Availability
The Internet access is meant for consumer customers and has an average availability of 97.0% over the year. The weather might also have an additional negative impact on the availability of Internet access, which is not within the control of skyDSL Europe. After 24 hours of continuous use of the Internet access the internet connection might be automatically disconnected for technical reasons. An immediate reconnection is possible.

The annual, average bandwidth of the Internet Access is determined as follows:
– To transmit their data Customers are assigned to pools using several different criteria. Those criteria include, inter alia, the currently used satellite, the spot-beam and transponder that is currently being used, as well as the customer's selected tariff including its degree of utilization.
– To achieve the maximum bandwidth of the Internet Access each of these pools the connection bandwidth at a contention ratio of 1:50 (assumed utilization rate for residential customers) multiplied by the number of customers assigned to this pool are made available.
– The bandwidth available within a pool for each customer will be multiplied by the number of customers of the pool.
– The sum of the bandwidths of all the pools of a tariff is divided by the total number of customers of this tariff.
– The calculation is done once per minute.
– The average of all values of the last 12 months is the annual, average bandwidth, while 3% of the best and worst values are not included in the average value determination.
A specific annual, average bandwidth is not guaranteed."
Back to top
« Last Edit: Jun 7th, 2012 at 9:05pm by Eric Johnston »  
 
IP Logged
 
Eric Johnston
YaBB Moderator
*****
Offline


Personal text from Profile,
Options, Top line

Posts: 2107
Reply #31 - Jun 7th, 2012 at 9:00pm  
Wow, that is difficult to understand and I'm not the only one to think this ...

Lets start with:

"Availability
The Internet access is meant for consumer customers and has an average availability of 97.0% over the year. The weather might also have an additional negative impact on the availability of Internet access, which is not within the control of skyDSL Europe."

Does that really mean that the service will be down for an average of 10.95 days per year, plus additional outage due to the weather?.   We all know that Ka band suffers severe attenuation in heavy rain, but I thought that the DVB-S/ACM system with its Adaptive Coding and Modulation was supposed to largely mitigate the effect.  e.g. With no ACM =  24 hours per year of complete failure in heavy rain.  With ACM = 24 hours per year, with bit rate reduced to half the clear sky value.

I can't understand the way they intend to measure "The annual, average bandwidth of the Internet Access".  

As a service offering why not tell us the maximum number of customers they will allow in each pool of 10 Mbit/s?.
e.g 342 customers per 10 Mbit/s or 29.3 kbit/s per site.

They assume 1:50 utilisation rate. Does this mean that they expect about 6 or 7 sites to be active simultaneously, sharing 10 Mbit/s  = 1.5 Mbit/s each?

Best regards, Eric.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
europe-satellite.com
Ex Member


Reply #32 - Jun 7th, 2012 at 10:19pm  
Quote: After 24 hours of continuous use of the Internet access the internet connection might be automatically disconnected for technical reasons. An immediate reconnection is possible.

Quote: The annual, average bandwidth of the Internet Access.

And much more nonsense ! http://ie.skydsl.eu/index.php?c=info&s=faq&cs=contract

...

Why is skyDSL able to offer its service without fair-use policy?
A fair-use policy is a system whereby the supplier defines that after a certain intensity of use (usually after a certain amount of consumed data volume), the available bandwidth of a connection will be automatically reduced. A fair-use policy is always applied in addition to a contention ratio rule to limit the usage of certain customers in order to maintain a high quality of service in the interest of all customers. Thus, for example for mobile communications (LTE) it’s usual that beyond a certain volume of the data transferred the connection will be reduced to the speed of UMTS (up to 384 kbps). In contrary skyDSL offers its connections with a usual contention ratio for the specific target group (residential consumers, business customers) and does not apply a fair-use policy. This can be done because of the classification of customers (see terms "pool" and "contention ratio").

What do the terms pool and contention ratio in connection with the availability of skyDSL/skyDSL2+ mean?
Unlike a dedicated leased line internet connection for business and residential customers usually have a contention ratio. While, for example a customer using a dedicated leased will permanently have a bandwidth of 10 mbps resulting in a possible transfer volume of 3,000 GB per month, customers having a contention ratio greater than 1:1 wil share the bandwidth of a connection. This approach is common, because customers are not active simultaneously with all other customers on the Internet. In case of a contention ratio of e.g. 1:50 the 3,000 GB of a 10 mbps connection will be conjointly available for 50 customers. Thus, the individual customers have about 60 GB on average per month available and because of the use of automatic redistribution (so-called "mixed calculation") depending on the individual customer usage patterns the customer may have used more or less than the average per month. Furthermore the available bandwidth of a certain customer’s connection may depend on the number of active users. This is the case if the real contention ratio is less than the contractually stipulated contention ratio. For comparison: According to Statista GmbH, Hamburg, Germany a data volume of 11.3 GB per ADSL users was expected in 2011 in Germany.

When "pooling" (using pools) customers are grouped according to specific criteria in a common pool. At skyDSL customer will be e.g. for technical reasons assigned to a pool which belongs to a particular satellite beam and satellite transponder, because of their location. Also, customers are grouped according to their booked tariff in pools. In addition, customers with similar usage profile within their respective tariff assigned to a pool. Since the available bandwidth of a certain connection within a pool depends on the number of active users of that pool, when using a connection with a contention ratio, the probability to reach the maximum bandwidth will decrease with an increasing intensity of use of the connection, because of the similarity of customer profiles within a pool.

*********************************************

Hi Eric,

No you are not the only one ............

I have never read so much rubbish Smiley, I really feel sorry for SkyDsl clients. I am wondering what the support level from SkyDsl is like?
Back to top
« Last Edit: Jun 12th, 2012 at 7:00pm by N/A »  
 
IP Logged
 
Powys
Ex Member


Reply #33 - Jun 12th, 2012 at 5:48pm  
Gosh, this is generous:

"– The bandwidth available within a pool for each customer will be multiplied by the number of customers of the pool. "

The more users there are, the bigger your own bandwidth gets.  Bang gavel - SOLD! Bargain!

John
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Powys
Ex Member


Reply #34 - Jun 12th, 2012 at 6:01pm  
Maybe Pladecalvo is sharing with some very heavy users, businesses perhaps, who end up hogging the bandwidth during the daytime.  Is there any reason to assume that all in contention on the same channel would be contracted for the same level of service?   Would a 'fat' one be able to squeeze out the 'thin' ones?

Only the ISP would know, I think, and it looks like Pladecalvo's ISP doesn't particularly care to examine the problem and keep a customer.

John
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
europe-satellite.com
Ex Member


Reply #35 - Jun 12th, 2012 at 7:04pm  
Quote:
Only the ISP would know, I think, and it looks like Pladecalvo's ISP doesn't particularly care to examine the problem and keep a customer.
John

*****
Mr. Cummings wrote us on 19-05-2012 the following:

"I appreciate you trying to help Frits but with someone as dumb as I am regarding technical stuff, I think you are going to be banging your head against the wall."

"Yep! I just wouldn't have a clue how to 'reset IP address'. You might as well as me to give a talk on nuclear fusion. Ha-Ha!!"

Our reply --> It will be close to impossible for any help-desk to support you from remote !
*****

I don't think you can blame the (any) ISP, it will be very difficult to support a customer like this.

We have advised him many times to get a professional IT engineer so he can communicate white the ISP on site to get this solved Smiley

Would a 'fat' one be able to squeeze out the 'thin' ones?
--> I don't think so, this is why a FAP system exist.
Back to top
« Last Edit: Jun 16th, 2012 at 9:02am by N/A »  
 
IP Logged
 
pladecalvo
Ex Member


Reply #36 - Jun 15th, 2012 at 6:49pm  
Quote:
We have advised him many times to get a professional IT engineer so he can communicate white the ISP on site to get this solved Smiley

.
...and I have told you many times that my system HAS been checked by a professional IT engineer and found to be OK. This is also borne out by the fact that during the night it works well. It is only during daytime periods that it slows down. This would indicate to me that there is nothing whatsoever wrong with my system....otherwise it would be slow ALL THE TIME...would it not??
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
europe-satellite.com
Ex Member


Reply #37 - Jun 16th, 2012 at 12:41pm  
Quote:
...and I have told you many times that my system HAS been checked by a professional IT engineer and found to be OK. This is also borne out by the fact that during the night it works well. It is only during daytime periods that it slows down. This would indicate to me that there is nothing whatsoever wrong with my system....otherwise it would be slow ALL THE TIME...would it not??

We have advised him many times to get a professional IT engineer so he can communicate white the ISP on site to get this solved.


Dear Sir,

Because your level of your computer knowledge it will be much better to get an IT engineer who can contact the hub and test the system together with the hub.

Succes,
Back to top
« Last Edit: Jun 17th, 2012 at 9:29am by N/A »  
 
IP Logged
 
Eric Johnston
YaBB Moderator
*****
Offline


Personal text from Profile,
Options, Top line

Posts: 2107
Reply #38 - Jun 16th, 2012 at 12:45pm  
The symptom of running slow in the day time, while working fast at night suggests to me genuine congestion or some misconfiguration at the Skylogic gateway.

Has the problem been reported to Skylogic and what do they have to say?.

I know getting a reponse from Skylogic is sometimes difficult, but we should at least try. Skylogic should at least try configuring a complete new site and seeing if that works any better. My guess is some subtle hub configuration error.

Best regards, Eric
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
pladecalvo
Ex Member


Reply #39 - Jun 17th, 2012 at 8:56pm  
Eric Johnston wrote on Jun 16th, 2012 at 12:45pm:
The symptom of running slow in the day time, while working fast at night suggests to me genuine congestion or some misconfiguration at the Skylogic gateway.

Exactly Eric - but it appears that Frits just can't get his head around that....even though I keep telling him.

I have reported the problem to Tooway on numerous occasions but they insist that there is no problem their end. I have tried to contact Skylogic but they won't even acknowledge receipt of e-mail.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
europe-satellite.com
Ex Member


Reply #40 - Jun 18th, 2012 at 7:51am  
Quote:
Exactly Eric - but it appears that Frits just can't get his head around that....even though I keep telling him.

I have reported the problem to Tooway on numerous occasions but they insist that there is no problem their end. I have tried to contact Skylogic but they won't even acknowledge receipt of e-mail.

Dear Sir,

Because your level of your computer knowledge it will be much better to get an IT engineer who can contact the hub and test the system together with the hub.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
fduvall
Ex Member


Reply #41 - Aug 23rd, 2012 at 2:32pm  
I have been a skydsl customer for about 6 months, with the 10Mbps+ service (no FAP) and also find it extremely slow most of the time. And there is NO direct customer service, only email. And the response time is abysmal.

I live outside of Barcelona, so no WiMAX or ADSL service. I am a heavy user, so with a different reseller we were always over the FAP. But I am looking at the latest offering from Tooway (18Mbps with 50GB data/month). I think this will work for me, but skydsl is not offering it and could not tell me if they will offer it in the future.

So time to switch. I created another thread to see if anyone is using the new service and who I should contract with. So open to any/all suggestions. I have Tooway installed so most interested in another Tooway reseller.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged