EU Referendum

Referendum on the proposed EU treaty

You would have thought a responsible government (i.e. the small group of ministers) would have been able to make a sensible decision about something as important as giving away control of our country to foreigners. Alas, they have no common sense and no confidence in themselves and are leaving the public to defend itself - so the people have to now to make sure that their representatives, the MPs, insist on a referendum. Now is the time for your MP to do what YOU want. Email your MP today with your views about the EU referendum. The MPs must make the Government ministers do what is morally required of them: Start doing what they know is right, putting the interests of this country first, and making it quite clear that we will remain self governing for ever, thank you very much.

We will not pipe down campaign

Let there be no misunderstanding -

Say NO to the traitors who would have us ruled by foreigners.

Here in Great Britain, we want a free, democratic, independent society with its own money and governed by its own laws.

News 6 March 2008: MPs reject a referendum on the re-named EU Constitution Treaty

More information from the DEMOCRACY MOVEMENT:

A majority of MPs voted yesterday evening against a referendum on the re-named EU Constitution Treaty, despite having promised one at the last election.

A Conservative amendment for a referendum was defeated by a majority of 63 votes - 311 votes to 248. A second referendum amendment, put down by rebel Labour MPs, was defeated by a majority of 64 votes.

The way that this treaty has been forced through Parliament lacks all legitimacy. Government promises of a public vote, of 'line-by-line scrutiny' and then of plentiful time to debate the treaty have all been broken.

Large swathes of vital powers the treaty gifts to remote EU institutions - such as in defence, borders, future treaty revision and voting weights - have been blocked from Parliamentary debate.
Most serious of all, various polls show that the Government has utterly failed to convince the public that the Lisbon Treaty is not the EU Constitution re-named, yet have still refused to honour their clear manifesto promise of a public vote.

How individual MPs voted can now be seen on the Referendum List campaign website

Essentially, the bulk of the Conservatives were supported by 29 Labour MPs, 15 Liberal Democrats, the Scottish and Welsh nationalist parties and some independents. But this was not enough to overcome the Government's majority.
A breakdown of how those referendum rebels we had identified behaved during the vote is as follows:
- of the 29 Labour MPs we had recorded as supporting a referendum, three did not vote and three voted against a referendum. One who voted against actually supported a referendum amendment at the Second Reading of the treaty Bill, and voted against its Second Reading altogether! So his switch is inexplicable. The remaining two who voted against a referendum have evidently been writing misleading letters to their constituents stating that they would support a public vote.

Six additional Labour MPs voted in support of a referendum. Of the 10 Lib Dem MPs we had recorded as supporting a referendum, one abstained and one did not vote. An additional seven voted in support of a treaty referendum, totalling fifteen rebels against Nick Clegg's policy.

The Democracy Movement has responded to the vote by announcing the launch of an 'Integrity Fund' to finance local campaigning in marginal constituencies between now and the next general election, which could now be just over a year away.

The fund will target MPs of all parties who have voted against the referendum they promised at the last election, and will finance the distribution of thousands of leaflets, advertising and other campaign activities in each target constituency. Funds have already been pledged to cover more than a dozen constituencies.

Democracy Movement director Stuart Coster said: "Those MPs who hoped this issue would go away once they had voted contrary to their election promises have made a huge miscalculation.
"On the basis of how MPs have voted on a Treaty referendum relative to their election promises, between now and the next general election we intend to ensure local voters know who they can and cannot trust."

After the remaining stages in the Commons, the Bill ratifying the Lisbon Treaty will move to the House of Lords where there will be further debates about a referendum.
If the Lords pass a referendum amendment, the issue could be put to the vote once again in the Commons.
The matter of this treaty and broken promises of a referendum is very far from over.

NEWS FROM THE DEMOCRACY MOVEMENT
http://www.democracymovement.org.uk
20 Jan 2008

As MPs began debating the Second Reading of the Bill ratifying the EU Constitution treaty today,

'Gordon the Referendum Rat' (a DM activist in a rat costume) was out in Westminster to highlight how the government is breaking its manifesto promise to hold a referendum.

As with his last outing - to the Labour Party conference in Bournemouth - our 'Gordon' received a great deal of interest from the media. He was photographed by a major picture agency and for several national newspapers, and can already be seen illustrating an article on the Daily Telegraph's Referendum page website.

He was also filmed by a BBC Newsnight camera crew, possibly for use in tonight's coverage (BBC2, 10:30pm).

There is going to be a referendum on the EU Treaty - but only in East Renfrewshire, Scotland.

Suitably re-named, 'Gordon' will now set off on a tour of the constituencies of anti-referendum MPs - especially those in marginal seats - to point out to local voters how their MP plans to rat on their election promise to give them a say before handing even more decision-making over to EU
institutions.

Anti-referendum MPs can expect to see a personalised 'Referendum Rat' in their own local newspapers very soon!

31 Jan 2007: Tom Paine's quotation "On Constitutions"

Have your say now - phone or write to your MP and insist about voting for a referendum. We want democracy.

It is too late to send your on-line petition to the Government. They closed it on 15 Feb 2007, so not listening now.

It is completely daft to allow foreign countries to decide what we are allowed to do, who we should fight for and to allow them to print money, the same as ours, to pay for their own ideas of quantities for civil servants, welfare, armies, health, pensions, education, foreign aid, etc.

Referendum

A referendum on the constitution is a waste of money, just an excuse for an incompetent government incapable of making the responsible decision to say NO to takeover by others.

So, please do what you can in the referendum to stop the idiots and make it clear that in future we govern ourselves and as an independent Britain.

In case any of you have problems remembering about the referendum please read all the pages linked below with repeated similar referendum messages - once you have done this maybe the message will have got across. Don't think you are stupid if you have to do this, it is just that the government has addled your brain with spin and its mind-numbing lies and counter lies over the past few years - they can't tell fact from fiction any more and the disease tends can spread like a weapon of mass self destruction.

Say YES to free trade with everyone and say YES to self determination. Say NO to dictatorial Euro-regulation and say NO to the Euro. Say YES to everyone in the world being allowed to have a satellite internet terminal - Freedom of speech and Freedom of access to information. Say YES to wearing any clothes you like but accept that you must put up with any ridicule, abuse or insults it may bring. Long may we continue to wear the kilt, or the turban, scarf or cross or whatever.

The proposed constitution is terrible, it is profoundly incoherent and would lead Europe into a doomed culture of inefficiency and bureaucratic petty controls.

Comment received 3rd March 2008

My Father, My grandfather fought in the last two world wars for our democracy and freedom, NOT to be ruled by Brussels. Ever since joining the common market we have lost our manufacturing companies, we have paid out enormous sums to keep the rest of Europe whilst they just keep taking our freedoms bit by bit, it is time to get a divorce.

Comment received: 24 June 2007:
Whether we have a referendum or not is not really the point. The whole exercise of an EU constitution is for the rest of Europe to do what Hitler failed to achieve! I AM BRITISH!!! and I don't want to be part of europe! If this goes ahead then why oh why did my nana's first husband die in a POW camp in 1943????? If this goes ahead then what was the purpose of 2 world wars and mass genocide? To turn us over to the Europeans is a disgrace, it is disrespectful to the memory of all those that died in both world wars! I for one do NOT want an EU constitution, lets have a BRITISH constitution instead!!!!!!

Email your comments to me now for inclusion...

Please email me at eric@satsig.net if you agree, disagree or just wish to add your comments here. Don't worry if you disagree, I am quite happy to let your views be known also - bear in mind that the future is unknown - we can only debate, decide and hope we are doing the best thing. The content of your emails will be inserted below so you can read other peoples opinions, with names etc removed, but you will no doubt recognise your own messages. Please also send images if you have any, cheering crowds, waving flags etc. Images would brighten up the pages a bit.

Other referendum pages on this site to help you get the above message into your head: Referendum-1 Referendum-2 (and yet more if you really need them)

News from the Labour Party conference 26 September 2007
Referendum campaigners from the Democracy Movement, Freedom Association and These Tides magazine were at the Labour Party Conference in Bournemouth, adding to the pressure on the government and MPs to honour their election promise of a vote on the EU Constitution Treaty.
As well as distributing hundreds of 'Gordon, Don't be an EU Cheat' leaflets to MPs, ministers and other delegates, a huge 20 x 12ft banner was set out on the beach below the cliffs and was clearly visible from inside the secure area. The banner was shown Tuesday evening on the BBC's Newsnight.
Also joining the protest was 'Gordon the Referendum Rat' (an activist in a rat costume), who can be seen on our web site asking former Labour leader & EU Commissioner Neil Kinnock why his party is ratting on their referendum promise.
Our 'Gordon' received a great deal of interest from the media and can also be seen on the Channel 4 News website.

Comment received: 13 Sept 2007:
I see that you are on the same side as us on this issue and indeed on the greater questions surrounding the EU. My belief is that we not only need a referendum on the resurrected constitution but whether we want to stay in a federal Europe as part of a soviet style system of government which will in time become totalitarian and power hungry. Pro Referendum Alliance

Pro-referendum rally: Parliament Square on October 27th, with scope for regional events up and down the country. The events in Parliament Square will start with the symbolic casting of ballots outside Parliament, and then move to a speaking event inside the Queen Elizabeth Conference Centre. Top-flight speakers from the world of politics, media and other walks of national life have been invited.

Read now a summary of the EU constitution all on just one page, by the democracy movement

Don't forget, this is rather of fundamental importance ...
In Europe you are only allowed to do what is permitted by european laws.
In Great Britain you can do anything, provided it is not prohibited by our own laws, and if any such own laws are stupid there is at least a proper democratic process for you to fix them.

Readers comments: Please write some words and send your views to me at eric@satsig.net I will add them here to the web site.
Vote NO on the constitution This page is Unbelievable political nonsense "19th Dec 2005: Yes, I agree with your comments and way of voting. Good luck. G"

News roundup:
11 June : EU referendum NO campaign     EU referendum NO campaign EURO in trouble
27 May: EU referendum - Vote No - campaign
3 June: EU referendum and EU constitution    EU Referendum and constitution - Quote of the week
30 May: Contribution to the EU referendum debate
17 June: News about the NO campaign - EU Constitution Pause   More about the NO campaign - CAP reform UK rebate debate
1 July: Luxembourg EU Referendum    Reform of the EU Some EU leaders still wanting more integration
4th Nov 2005:   Open Europe
April 2007: Blair tries to wriggle out of allowing the people to decide on new EU Treaty

Navigation: Own laws Satellite Internet for everyone EU Referendum rally Formation of anti-eu campaign 2006 budget
The EU constitution is not compatible with democracy France to say NO in EU referendum ? EU referendum results

Celebrate Victory over the European Dictator - Admiral Lord Nelson and the British Navy defeated the combined French and Spanish invasion fleet at the Battle of Trafalgar in 1805.

Freedom of the press fundamental for democracy By Hans-Martin Tillack. Excellent article about EU officials trying to stop people investigating fraud and corrupt activities. Read the news: EU negotiations June 2007

Other useful links:
UK Independence Party , The Libertarian Alliance is a non-partisan group fighting statism in all its forms and working for the creation of a truly free society. Mr. Jens-Peter Bonde, MEP from the Danish June Movement and President, of the EDD-group, launches a website, where relevant documents and, public debates on transparency can be found. Eurosceptic search engine The Silent Majority OECD in figures Campaign for an Independent Britain New Alliance British Weights and Measures Association, TEAM - The Europe-wide anti-Maastricht group, The Freedom Association, The Truth About Europe Campaign - detailed leaflets, Politico's Bookstore. Containing [probably] the only Eurosceptic book shelf in the country! Reference materials etc. Good for additional links to other sites. Your chance to register a protest against the single currency., EURO-KNOW - a group of economists against the Euro. Find out the real facts! The Eurosceptic, The Democrat On-Line, The British Weights and Measures Association, Drive the Flag Campaign Union Jack (Flag) Number Plates, European Single Currency con Britain & the Euro, Free Britain

Some recent email correspondence: (most recent 15th Dec 2007):

Hi There,

Switzerland have probably not been pushed to join, after all the cowardly weasels pushing this agenda need somewhere to run when it all goes pear shaped. There is always an available bolt hole in times such as these. It is no coincidence that this is being pushed through more rapidly now, as we have reached, 'peak oil'. Economies around the world are going to suffer in the next few years as oil production goes down. Western economies will start to suffer and so regulations such as cutting the speed limit, shorter working hours, increased taxation etc. will be brought in.

Taxation will increase to cut spending, thus lessening demand for goods which would be produced using oil. The sorry part of all of this is that the polititians think that Marxist policies, proven not to work, will buy them time until a solution to the energy crises is found. The politicians are following an agenda thought up by the large banking institutions who have everything to lose. Nobody will stop the ratification of this agenda, it's a done deal.
It only remains to see what part two of this agenda will reveal, I would imagine that eugenics will play a big part as the new world order players seek to stabilise their position and decrease the population of the world to make to make it sustainable.

---

Hi there,

I don't understand what your site is all about - it seems to be about not letting people have a referendum on whether the UK should sign a constitution with Europe.

Anyway, you're wrong. We're not getting a vote, although we should. The UK is based on a democratic, free and open society, any action which removes power from Westminster and gives it to Brussels should be put to a public vote. I can not see how you disagree with this basic principle of democracy.

Please explain?

--
You make a good point. I had not set out to say no to the idea of a referendum, but rather to try and get the message across that I was not happy with the idea of being ruled from abroad by foreigners.

If the MPs we elected had any sense they would not give away control of their country to foreigners and there would be no talk about referendums. The problem is that we have elected a number of irresponsible, low quality and badly behaved people. Instead of a team effort by responsible MPs leading to the best outcome we have the impression of a cunning traitor leading a bunch of lemmings into Morecambe Bay's quicksands.

We need to somehow persuade the present MPs to be more alert and sensible. A referendum is a possible alternative, but is not ideal as it takes the responsibility away from the MPs. We elected them to do a job and they should do it better, with a higher degree of responsibility, skill, competence and common sense. It is not the job of the electorate to do referendums, to try and force the MPs to get it right. The MPs need to get a grip themselves now and do what they are there to do.
--

Thanks for your reply - much appreciated.

I agree that we shouldn't be run and governed by anyone other than elected officials. We did in deed as you quite rightly say elect them to do their job, however ultimately a decision of this proportion needs to be put to a democratic referendum. The only reason they wont do this, is because they know the overwhelming majority would vote "no".

Naturally the Government deny this is the reason, instead trying to dumbfound us, insisting that they would not transfer power in 4 key areas: Taxation and Benefits, Common Law, Foreign Policy and the Charter of Fundamental Rights, and as such no referendum is required.

In a true democratic society, it doesn't come down to who's "job" it is... it comes down to who's "right" it is... nay, who's "Duty" it is... in this particular case, it is the duty and right of the citizens of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland to decide where they wish to be governed. The only true fair and legal way to acertain the result of such a decision, is for a national referendum.

I agree entirely with your comments of:

"Instead of a team effort by responsible MPs leading to the best outcome we have the impression of a cunning traitor leading a bunch of lemmings into Morecambe Bay's quicksands."

The reason is of course that of personal gain. Tony has openly said on a number of occasions that he is concerned about his so called "legacy"... he should be less concerned with that and more concerned with the successful running and continued development of this country. If he got that part right, his much valued legacy would follow...

Alas I digress.... the underlying point is that regardless of what MP's are elected for on a day to day running of the Nation, such a decision which potentially sees our entire way of life turned onto its head, should be left to, and only left to, the people of that country.

If Tony is afraid that we will reject it, i would suggest that's because it has all been done behind closed doors, with minimal open discussion of the cost/benefits and implications.

If we were all clued up fully on the deal, then perhaps we'd be more open to the suggestion of merging with Europe in its entirety...

--

Received 12 Sept 2007:

I remember when we had a successful fishing industry and our farming industry wasn't in constant turmoil, with farmers contemplating suicide.

I remember when you could do a job without filling in 42 sheets of paper and working the hours that you wanted without being told how long to work.

How can we still be part of an organisation that cannot account for £1 billion every year and has never had a set of accounts ratified. If this was a company registered in this country the directors would be jailed.

As far as immigration is concerned the reason Africans are invading Europe is because they cannot export their products to Europe because it has flooded their markets with cheap subsidised products thanks to the environmental disaster known as the Common Agricultural Policy. The only thing they can export is themselves ( Can you blame them ).

The sooner we get out of Europe the better. Incidentally can you name 2 very successful countries in Europe not in the EU union? Yes, Norway and Switzerland. Why don't they join? They are not so bloody stupid.

--

Page started 18 April 2004, most recent amendment 21 April 2008