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Service Providers >> TooWay and KA-SAT satellite >> Tooway dish good satellite getting wrong network

Message started by thetoad on Nov 4th, 2009 at 12:54pm

Title: Tooway dish good satellite getting wrong network
Post by thetoad on Nov 4th, 2009 at 12:54pm
First I apologize for my poor English.

I am in Italy and I have a problem activacting my tooway account.

I point my dish using a sat finder and i have good signal (9-10 dB on very cloudy day)

I call tooway italy to get the Activation Code to insert on the activation web page and they tell me i cant activiate because i am on the FRENCH network (in network i get HB6-K159(F) (see image here ) and they tell me the dish is not in good position to get the Italian network.

That sound strange to me, if i am pointing on the good satellite with good signal why i have to move the dish?

Some one can tell me how to do to get the right network?

Thank for any answer

This is some more info from my tooway modem

operating status:

Downstream IF        1376.000000        [MHz]
Downstream Symbol Rate       30.000000       [Msps]
Downstream Mode       MR 8PSK 3/4       
Current Downstream SNR       9.9       [dB]
Current Downstream Receive Power       -25.88       [dBm]
Upstream IF       2132.399902       [MHz]
Upstream Channel       11       
Upstream Transmit Power       -224.0       [dBm]

scans parameters
Downstream Scan IF Start Frequency      1000.000000      [MHz]
Downstream Scan IF End Frequency      1500.000000      [MHz]
Downstream Scan IF Frequency Step Size      10.000000      [MHz]
Pre-selected Symbol Rate(s)      22.5       [Msps]
Range Symbol Rate(s) {start:step:end}      15.0 : 15.0 : 30.0      [Msps]
Last Known Good Downstream IF      1376.000000      [MHz]
Last Known Good Downstream Symbol Rate      30.0      [Msps]
Maximum Upstream Frequency Offset      45000.000      [Hz]
Number of Upstream Frequency Search Steps      19      
Minimum Upstream Scan Transmit Power      -10.0      [dBm]
Maximum Upstream Scan Transmit Power      0.0      [dBm]
Number of Upstream Power Search Steps      2      

event log:
WED NOV 04 12:43:49 2009      REG-REQ Sent: Registration complete
THU JAN 01 00:00:40 1970      SM Configuration File Download
THU JAN 01 00:00:27 1970      RNG-RSP: -2 [ticks], 0 [Hz], -0.50 [dBm]
THU JAN 01 00:00:26 1970      RNG-RSP: 1 [ticks], -9323 [Hz], 0.00 [dBm]
THU JAN 01 00:00:25 1970      RNG-RSP: 46761 [ticks], 0 [Hz], 0.00 [dBm]
THU JAN 01 00:00:19 1970      US Scan: 2132.399902 [MHz], Channel 11
THU JAN 01 00:00:17 1970      DS NAPA: Success
THU JAN 01 00:00:16 1970      DS Acquire: 1375.498901 [MHz], 30.00 [Msps], 9.00 [dB], MR
THU JAN 01 00:00:10 1970      DS Scan: 1375.498901 [MHz]
THU JAN 01 00:00:06 1970      DS Scan: 1376.000000 [MHz]

message edited by forum admin to put clear image above of the activation screen.

Title: Re: Tooway dish good satellite getting wrong netwo
Post by on Nov 4th, 2009 at 1:22pm
It is strange ............
Where did you bought modem ?
You should be able to activate on the Frence beam (I think).
Maybe the modem belongs to a diffrent agent/reseller and you need a pin/subscription from that one.
Signal looks good.

Title: Re: Tooway dish good satellite getting wrong netwo
Post by Forum Admin on Nov 4th, 2009 at 3:28pm
On Hotbird 6 Ka Tooway satellite, there is one large downlink beam that covers much of Europe, including Italy so your downlink is not the problem.

The Ka band uplinks however are split amongst 4 beams, see below:

Your location in Italy will govern your choice of uplink beam.  If you are in central or southern Italy then you need to be in the yellow beam.

Where are you located ?

Please say how you obtained the dish and modem?.

If you have bought the dish and modem only, and have not paid for a monthly service contract, then you need to contact any reseller/service provider  and they will re-register your hardware with the teleport hub and make you operational.

If you have bought the dish and modem and have paid for monthly service contract, then contact your existing service provider and get them to resolve the registration with the teleport hub.

This page Tooway satellite dish pointing should help you optimise dish polarisation (rotation of the dish using the large scale on the back).

Best regards, Eric.

Title: Re: Tooway dish good satellite getting wrong netwo
Post by thetoad on Nov 4th, 2009 at 4:35pm
HI thank to all for the fast answer,

i get my modem from open sky Italy, and i pay a monthly service.

I call them few time and they answer me: move your dish without any other explication.

i am in north of Italy
Latitude = 45.6949, Longitude = 9.6700
Lat    = 45 degrees,   41.69 minutes   North
Long = 9 degrees,   40.20 minutes   East

hotbird 6 13° East
Dish elevation= 37.3, Azimuth= 174.9 (magnetic compass), Polarisation= -3.2 anti-clockwise, Blue scale skew= 93.2

and looking at the map Eric post i must be on the edge of the green uplink beam.
That maybe the problem.

the uplink beam spot depend on polarization?

i must point the dish at -3.2 polrasation concording with the info i find on Satellite dish pointing calculator for the Europe Tooway page.

then i put in my raven dish at 93.2° on the back.

i did something wrong?
how i can be inside the yellow beam?

Title: Re: Tooway dish good satellite getting wrong netwo
Post by on Nov 4th, 2009 at 4:49pm
Leave modem on for a couple of hours or even longer. When it finally lock you won't have the problem again. Inform your provider in the meantime, they have to contact Skylogic, I believe they can force the modem to connect. We had the same problem in the past with a few installs.

Title: Re: Tooway dish good satellite getting wrong netwo
Post by Eric Johnston on Nov 4th, 2009 at 6:28pm
You have not done anything wrong.

Looking at the map you should be able to work your uplink in either the green, red or yellow beams.  The yellow beam looks slightly better to me.    It maybe that the modem thinks all the beams are about the same and has picked the green beam using an arbitrary or random process.   As the satelllite wobbles slightly whichever beam is best could vary.

This is a matter for your service provider and the teleport in Turin to resolve.  It is no good suggesting you move your dish 100 miles south east to make it clearly in the yellow beam !

As suggested above, leaving your modem on for a couple of hours might work - while hoping that the 'system' will discover that the yellow beam is better.   If no success after 2 hours, cycle the mains power and maybe the modem will experiment with some other uplink frequencies and find a good one in the yellow (or red !) beam.  The reason it takes so long for Tooway modems to lock up is that it experiments by trial and error with a large number of receive frequencies and transmit frequencies and transmit power levels until it finds something that works.

In the early days of Wildblue they had problems with sites on the boundary of 2 or 3 beams, but they solved it. But, their system is different in that there are multiple downlink beams as well, with each uplink beam having a corresponding downlink beam. In your case the modem does not know (from the downlink signal level) in what uplink beam it is located.

I would recommend that you tell your service provider that it is not practical for you to move your site many miles further south east and that they should contact Skylogic for assistance in getting your uplink into the right frequency transponder.

Best regards, Eric.

Title: Re: Tooway dish good satellite getting wrong netwo
Post by on Nov 8th, 2009 at 2:16pm
Just wondering, does it work ? What was the problem and how was it solved ?

Title: Re: Tooway dish good satellite getting wrong netwo
Post by thetoad on Nov 11th, 2009 at 10:29am
Hi all,
I solved the problem this morning after having long talk with open sky italy.
The problem is to get the Italian beam (yellow one - k158 )
I need to turn the LNB 90° clockwise (if i look at the satellite) and then calculate the polarization (-3.2° in my case) from that starting position.

The pdf that opensky italy give where they explain how to install the dish is really not clear. Specially because if you turn the raven dish 90° you don't have any scale any more (to resolve I did a mark on top screw to have new reference).

I will take some picture of the dish in right position and i will post it here; can be useful for other people.

Otherwise now everything is working great, I get this value on site (server Rome):

Thanks again for the help.

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