SatSig topic:

Tooway usage control "how it works"

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Nov 3^rd, 2009 at 7:45pm

We have updated the Tooway GOS document on our internet site. We have tried to keep it as simple as possible incl. an explaination of how the control mechanism of bandwidth control from Skylogic works.

Document can be found on https://www.europe-satellite.com/EMS/pdf_files/gos/GOS_tooway-GOS.pdf

If any questions, please don't hesitate to contact us.

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Edited by forum admin - table image above extracted from the pdf file and put here instead of an image of a Twoway dish.

Jan 19^th, 2010 at 2:07pm

The GOS documentation states that the uplaod and download figures are weighted and combined to give the total usage. The aggregate is given as 0.5 x download + 1.5 x upload. So 1MB up is worth 3MB down, and together they give 2MB aggregate. Have I got that right?

So the Basic limit of 1200MB might be reached by, for example, 300MB total upload plus 600MB download. In any given hour, the imbalance might have puzzling effects, such as maybe posting photos to Flickr, when there is little down, buts lots of up.

If this is actually the case then some of the people in the long threads about FAP problems, where they do not believe they have used their quota in the time applied, might have been hit by their uploads.

Regards, John

Jan 19^th, 2010 at 4:39pm

I'm not sure about the weighted total traffic calculation.

1500 Mbytes download + 300 Mbytes upload might equal 1200 Mbytes total, if worked out as follows:

1500 x 0.5 = 750
300 x 1.5 = 450
Total = 1200

Regarding other puzzling effects, it is important to understand the concept of the sliding time windows. Once you drop out of overload the system does allow high speed once again but you need to use the high speed cautiously or you will quickly be back to overload. The traffic is recalculated every 5 minutes, adding up all of the last hour, last 4 hours etc. Note that, during period midnight to 6am GMT, traffic counts half.

All above is "interpretation" of the GOS documents, so what actually happens may be different or adjusted at any time by Skylogic, Italy.

If you are uploading large images consider editing the images first to make the file size smaller. Reducing the size of the picture, and increasing the jpg compression helps. I have been using Adobe Photoshop Elements recently and saving images using gif format with a limited range of colours. The picture in a recent post of a Direcway-Skycasters-iDirect dish and snow covered ground, had only 16 gif colours and is 43.7k bytes for picture size of 428x298 pixels. See: https://www.satsig.net/images/hughes/direcway-idirect-conversion.gif

If you choose Bentley Walker for Tooway service, they provide on-line access to your traffic amounts: https://www.bentley-walker.com/toowayusage.php , so you can see where you stand at any time. Europe-Satellite have the same thing: https://www.europe-satellite.com/EMS/tooway_stats/tooway_stats.htm The software behind all this on-line access is rather complex and has cost a great deal to implement and since this web site pushed hard for this facility to be added, I hope you find it of value.

Best regards, Eric.

Jan 19^th, 2010 at 9:59pm

The Basic (2.4GB on Tooway KU) is really designed for Basic use, hence the name. If you are looking at uploading and downloading larger files, streaming video etc you need to look at one of the larger packages, which go up to 12GB.

On the Basic package it is very easy to FAP without realising it as we have become so used to 'unlimited' internet access with certain ADSL packages.

I don't use Facebook, Twitter and the such like, preferring instead to actually talk to people, so the Bronze package (4GB) is perfect for our home and office use, but if you are someone who does like communicating using channels such as this then you are likely to need a higher level package, which of course brings a higher quarterly cost.

Jan 20^th, 2010 at 9:40am

Thanks for the replies. I have not become used to any ADSL speeds, since I can't get broadband. Well, except for 30 minutes over a period of 4 months in 2004, when I got 128kbps... Since I only get a flaky 34kbps dial-up, you will appreciate that I do not have a habit of sending large files. But then, my first modem was 300 baud, back in 1970-something.

All I was interested in was having the weighting method confirmed. What seems to be confirmed instead is that nobody is too sure of the quota measurement. Also, since TooWay apply acceleration, there is also the question of whether the quota is applied to the compressed data or the original data.

In average browsing, a three to one download/upload ratio would not be out of the ordinary, and so the straight download figure would be similar to the weighted aggregate. But downloading files rather than page elements might result in a greater total of download without exeeding the aggregate quota.

The Ka basic package has a limit of 1200MB, I'll start with that and find out for myself. 1200MB is as much as I could download in a month with my dial-up, if I had nothing better to do with my phone.

Terrific site this, I'm spending too much (dial-up) time trawling through it!

Regards, John

Jan 20^th, 2010 at 9:52am

We can't get ADSL either and had to cope with a mobile dongle (which would only work in one part of the house) until we installed Tooway.

You might find going with KU on Eurobird 3 is better. Price is the same and you get twice as much allowance, 1.2GB on KA and 2.4GB on KU for same money.

KU also seems to work better in bad weather. Portugal has been windy and wet (inches of rain in a few hours and winds up to 80mph) and our KU Tooway has stayed on with very little downtime.

You never know with all this extra upload and download capacity you may find you are on the web more than you think.

As you say fantastic website, helping not only professional but amateurs alike. A big thanks to Eric and everyone that contributes.

Jan 20^th, 2010 at 10:17am

Quote:

Thanks for the replies. I have not become used to any ADSL speeds, since I can't get broadband. Well, except for 30 minutes over a period of 4 months in 2004, when I got 128kbps... Since I only get a flaky 34kbps dial-up, you will appreciate that I do not have a habit of sending large files. But then, my first modem was 300 baud, back in 1970-something.

All I was interested in was having the weighting method confirmed. What seems to be confirmed instead is that nobody is too sure of the quota measurement. Also, since TooWay apply acceleration, there is also the question of whether the quota is applied to the compressed data or the original data.

In average browsing, a three to one download/upload ratio would not be out of the ordinary, and so the straight download figure would be similar to the weighted aggregate. But downloading files rather than page elements might result in a greater total of download without exeeding the aggregate quota.

The Ka basic package has a limit of 1200MB, I'll start with that and find out for myself. 1200MB is as much as I could download in a month with my dial-up, if I had nothing better to do with my phone.

Terrific site this, I'm spending too much (dial-up) time trawling through it!

Regards, John

Hi John,

You can always check your usage any time of the day if your satellite provider provide this online (https://www.europe-satellite.com/EMS/tooway_stats/tooway_stats.htm). KA is a bit more sensitive for rain but at the end of the day we did not note any different between KA and KU except the monthly volume.

Wind should not effect a KA or KU dish as long installation is done properly. If you install yourself, have a look at the installation info at our website https://www.europe-satellite.com/EMS/systems/systems216c.htm

Also good to mention the following :

Tooway systems are for "HOME USE" and support is limited on it (ticket system). In any other environment where a connection is crucial we would suggest a different system (HX or Evolution).

Jan 20^th, 2010 at 10:40am

It turns out my 30 minutes of broadband was in 2006, not 2004. Seems so long ago.

I'll be using the Ka satellite, since I have a used Ka system here already. The alternative would have been Astra2Connect, but the TooWay was available. Total cost is a major factor.

The only mobile which will work here at home is Vodafone, and that is only really capable of SMS indoors. There is no 3G signal anywhere around here, nor 2.5G, nor 2G. There is no DAB radio. When they switch off the anloalogue radio we will be stuffed. We are only 220m high, but Wales has an awful lot of crevices, and we seem to be in one.

My long-retired neighbours 250m up the lane installed Sky when the area TV went digital in November. I believe this was since the terrestrial digital signal is poor. We don't have TV, so don't know for sure. (Or care, obviously. And before someone asks, no, we haven't had TV in the last 35 years, not interested. Seem to manage very well without it. As long as we can get radio.)

We will be paying a 50p per month levy on the phone line from March to fund Mr. Brown's 'Digital Economy' infrastructure impovements. That seems to be limited to fibre-optic connections in Cardiff, 2.5 hours drive away. When we were on a small island off the Turkish coast (Fourni, Greece) in September, even they had broadband. By what means, I don't know. So, we'll try satellite. If it looks good other than the Ka band, we might move to another scheme.

When I have the stuff up and running I'll report on it here, assuming there'd be enough quota left to upload some pictures! I'll look at the effects of different upload/download mixes, if I can.

It's snowing again, would that be worse than rain? Maybe I should post that as another topic. This one has wondered off somewhat, for which I apologise.

Regards, John

Jan 20^th, 2010 at 10:49am

Topics on here generally wabble off a bit so I wouldn't worry.

We are 450 metres up in the mountains in southern Portugal and at the moment my mobile on Vodafone only works if I go outside and stand on the patio wall!

So much for technology and would you believe all new builds here now have to have a fibre-optic line installed. So when will they bring in a service on that - 2050???

Best of luck with your self install. There are loads of tips and help on other threads which I am sure you will find if needed.

Wind doesn't affect the performance of Tooway, I was just highlighting the fact that the weather has been terrible down here over the last 4 to 5 weeks. We spent 2 weeks in the clouds with pretty zero visibility.

PS - the Tooway stats link on Bentley Walker is down again.

Jan 20^th, 2010 at 11:06am

Quote:

It's snowing again, would that be worse than rain? Maybe I should post that as another topic. This one has wondered off somewhat, for which I apologise.

Regards, John

Rain and/or snow can effect your system because the thin layer/film of rain/snow can change the shape/focus of the dish/lnb/buc and signals are going everywhere except the right direction. Signal drops also when you have a sunny day in Wales (lucky men) and it is bad weather in Turin !!!! They have the same problem at the main hub.

TIP: If the humidity is high it can take a while before the raindrops/snow dissapears from your lnb front, in that case you have to clean it by hand to get back online, if not it can take a while ! (only KA).

ps. It looks, it will start snowing soon in London to Sad

ps. Latest weather report (13:25H) London, no snow but rain

Jan 20^th, 2010 at 3:29pm

Thanks for all that. I expect to keep the dial-up going for a while, but I might get to ditch the 'call waiting' service.

London does not know what snow is

They cannot see past the M25 down there. I see Eric suggested inverting the tranceiver assembly (I summarise here) to help it shed water. I shall look at that possibility. Is there any reason the things are always assembled with the electronics in the lower half, I wonder?

Meanwhile, my dial-up is also weather dependent, due to rubbish connections down the line. It can get leaks tracking down the poles to earth sometimes, when the the wind & rain is right. Or wrong.

Regards all,

John

Jan 20^th, 2010 at 6:30pm

Quote:

London does not know what snow is

They cannot see past the M25 down there.

A view from our London office, It looks like it is ......... SNOW

Our Spanish office is a 45 min drive from the ski slopes in Andora

SNOW SNOW SNOW again !!

ps.We will deleted this post after 24 hours because this is not the place for weather bulletins

Forum admin: Maybe rewrite this posting to the "Anything Else - General and Other" category if you wish - nice picture, Eric.

Jan 21^st, 2010 at 3:30pm

No, that looks like heavy frost. A mere dusting. I have sent Frits a couple of pictures of what snow looks like in Wales. He is welcome to repost them as a response to his alleged 'snow' pictures if they have been moved rather than deleted. I don't have the speed to repeat it!

Regards, John

(Nice composition, though. From what Londoners call a 'hill', too. )